pouët.net

gracchus by kolor [web] & freestyle [web]
[nfo]
screenshot added by diver on 2002-09-02 15:11:49
platform :
type :
release date : september 2002
release party : Evoke 2002
compo : pc 4k
ranked : 1st
  • rulez 78
  • is ok 15
  • sucks 1
popularity : 1%
 1%
best intro
  • rulez 0.82
alltime top: #824
added on the 2002-09-02 00:18:47 by dipswitch dipswitch

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comments

amazing ! that's what comes out when two 4k maestros come together.
rulezadded on the 2002-09-02 00:20:25 by dipswitch dipswitch
Am I still dreaming or what !
Could it be possible, this intro is just technical and design perfection.
rulezadded on the 2002-09-02 00:34:10 by Sanx Sanx
Jeesus "phukkin'" Christ!
rulezadded on the 2002-09-02 00:55:34 by dixan dixan
i think this intro set kind of a new standard for 4ks, time to start with the competition now
rulezadded on the 2002-09-02 01:04:56 by dalezr dalezr
this is the shit!
rulezadded on the 2002-09-02 02:23:33 by robotriot robotriot
Hmm it crashed on my system (athlon, gf4, xp) after the music had played for a few seconds, and the screen was still black. :(
But the music was quite good for a 4k
added on the 2002-09-02 02:51:09 by Factory Factory
doesn't work here (duron650,radeon8500,winxp). i only see the one main light-emitting polygon in each scene obscured by the polys before it (i.e. the radiosity stuff doesn't seem to work).

other than that, it's nice, but it would've been REALLY cool if the scenes had contained something else than just cubes.
rulezadded on the 2002-09-02 03:00:44 by ryg ryg
only the .exe worked here (p4,gf3,xp) which is over the size-limit, but supposing the .com contains the same stuff i have to say, we reached the age of the boring flybies in 4k too. ;))
This one definitely sets the rules. let's try to bend'em!
rulezadded on the 2002-09-02 07:26:08 by FooLman FooLman
I'd have loved this minimalistic shit even if it was in a 64k... =)
rulezadded on the 2002-09-02 08:52:22 by pan pan
beautifull production, i think 64k is too large for some people, they don't want to waste our diskspace ; )
rulezadded on the 2002-09-02 10:09:09 by reaktor2k reaktor2k
"i think this intro set kind of a new standard for 4ks, time to start with the competition now"

bwahahaha :)

anyway, lovely lighting and colors.
a bit boring tho..
rulezadded on the 2002-09-02 10:12:22 by superplek superplek
cool! i just wish the 4k version would work. until i see that, let's call it an 13 k intro.
added on the 2002-09-02 12:44:17 by chaos chaos
i can answer maybe one or two comments:

the problem that the 4k version is unlikely to work on many pcs is that (which is nowadays pretty usual for win 4ks) does import by ordinal on everything, which means that if you do not have the exactly correct version of win2k (including the matching servicepack) it will fail. i hope they mentioned which version of win is required in the .nfo :)
about the .exe size: it is not compressed tightly at all, because another win-4k-trick is to write out a .com file to disk and run that to save bytes. however, some people do not like intros writing to disk and the intro would not run from eg. cd. so they choose to include the big exe for maximum viewing comfort & compatibility and not just a tiny one with import by name only.
ryg: it's a wonder that you see anything on radeon and not a crash :) . MAYBE check the advanced settings of the card though: sucky ATI tends to default setup ogl to 16bits on all textures even if you upload 32bit textures. set to 32bit. also check that any kind of fsa is off (!). Again a 4k thingy that you just don't have the bytes to disable fsa manually.
added on the 2002-09-02 13:32:06 by shiva shiva
awsome.
maybe it's interresting to point out that muhmac had to shiink the code 200bytes on the partyplace. respect.
thumbs up multiple times.

to chaos: it woks fine on my machine. :)
rulezadded on the 2002-09-02 13:38:31 by abductee abductee
shiva: didn't help. anyway, when a production is THAT bound to the computer it was coded on, calling it a 4k intro is not kinda true - if you require a THAT exact match of the windows version, you're relying on several hundred megabytes of stuff, only they're not in the zip file.

still, i have some problems with that.
added on the 2002-09-02 13:59:42 by ryg ryg
cubes.
smooth dynamic lighting.
very designish colours.
impressive music.
rulezadded on the 2002-09-02 14:13:49 by hfr hfr
yes. music is cool for a 4k. lightning, too.
rulezadded on the 2002-09-02 15:13:29 by diver diver
hmm hmm, i dont know a lot about coding,
but looks impressive to me, especially in 4k
rulezadded on the 2002-09-02 15:15:53 by faxe faxe
the 13k version worked on my pc - but a note on the lameass dll-importing is that building a jumptable in memory based on the dlls on the current system is most like not more than 100bytes bigger than jumping to a fixed position in the dlls.
oh yeh, nice visuals.
100 bytes is 2.5% of all available space in a 4k. Besides it requires more space. Think: Every function per name, that's about 15bytes per function. Also be aware that packing behaves a lot more different with 4ks than on a 64k.
and ryg: i didn't find any dx dlls, heck not even kernel32.dll in any fr intro :) i think it's ok to raise the match a bit for 4ks - wish i had problems like this :)

and now i stop explaining 4k coding to you people - figure it out yourself :P
added on the 2002-09-02 16:02:14 by shiva shiva
the music is really nice, but i would have liked to see more than just cubes. I think i like varus better.
rulezadded on the 2002-09-02 16:02:39 by a_lee_n a_lee_n
Nice music and design, but where are the textures and effects?
added on the 2002-09-02 16:20:29 by kusma kusma
by the way
rulezadded on the 2002-09-02 16:20:41 by kusma kusma
shiva: ahem, if you'd done some research you'd know that i indeed already have made 2 4kbs this year (which both uses jumptables and thus works on most windows versions).

actually i made my jumplist code available on my webpage (on demand) some months ago : http://www.daimi.au.dk/~kaae/code/jumplist/.
Looks VERY nice.
rulezadded on the 2002-09-02 16:26:02 by Shifter Shifter
Great again.
rulezadded on the 2002-09-02 18:14:55 by nufan nufan
no comment.
rulezadded on the 2002-09-02 18:17:18 by got got
That's realtime calculated radiosity :)
One of the most impressive/clever thing I've ever seen.
Nice music, nice visuals and a great idea...
keep on.
rulezadded on the 2002-09-02 19:13:19 by rIO rIO
dope!
rulezadded on the 2002-09-02 20:16:51 by brioche brioche
Really kicking stuff for 4k, respect!
added on the 2002-09-02 23:16:46 by Crest Crest
WOWOWOWOWOWOWOWOWOOWOWOWOWOWOWOWOw
love love love love love.
rulezadded on the 2002-09-03 16:05:33 by med med
it has the spam, plus the bacon and the eggs. yeah!1
rulezadded on the 2002-09-03 18:09:12 by synteesi synteesi
love the softsynth, but have to agree with ryg that it's not really a 4k. thumbs up anyway.
rulezadded on the 2002-09-03 22:27:42 by sang-soo sang-soo
compo version didn't work on my pc
party version randomly crashes at some point and write some 80 mbytes temporary files

still it was really something in the compo..
artsy minimal visuals meeting very clever code

congrats muhmac & noize ..
rulezadded on the 2002-09-03 23:07:36 by florent florent
very cool intro, cool style. some more than boxes would have rocked, but still...excellent!
runs well on my box, both in win98 and xp on gf2mx. only the last 3-4 scenes are bugged, one wall is always completely white. or should it be that way ? guess not...
rulezadded on the 2002-09-03 23:27:56 by styx^hcr styx^hcr
i think the white wall is not a bug. i think thy could make different colors :). no, the white is also the light. i like the white.
added on the 2002-09-04 00:09:24 by diver diver
Probably the best sound-quality yet in a 4K. At little dullish in the visual department, but damn fine considering the size.
rulezadded on the 2002-09-04 00:16:06 by sea_monkey sea_monkey
sexy. roxxor.
rulezadded on the 2002-09-04 00:20:16 by funktion funktion
The only thing that's missing here is a cornell box:)
rulezadded on the 2002-09-04 06:56:00 by uncle-x uncle-x
i like this stuff. great work!
rulezadded on the 2002-09-04 09:11:05 by sobec sobec
You think u enjoyed it?!?
Check my pants fer christ's sake...
rulezadded on the 2002-09-04 09:19:32 by verm verm
Best 4k so far IMHO. Boooozah!
rulezadded on the 2002-09-04 11:57:21 by Drift Drift
great music
rulezadded on the 2002-09-04 15:33:37 by marlowe marlowe
Damn nice. Before 4k intros were only showoffs for coders but this one has actually some artistic aspects. Really nice indeed.
rulezadded on the 2002-09-05 10:32:52 by melw melw
rulezadded on the 2002-09-06 23:11:43 by kurli kurli
Yes it's a great idea and it's brillliantly executed. Few things are more deserving of a thumbs up!
rulezadded on the 2002-09-07 01:23:09 by Jare Jare
great.
and even the compo version works here :)
rulezadded on the 2002-09-07 01:55:17 by cp_ cp_
Really one of the best 4k's I've seen so far!! Great work...nice design.
The 4k version doesn't work here though (winXP) but the 12k does it nicely...
Will there be a 'final' 4k version then maybe? ;-)
just for the record... :-)

can't wait to see who will be next in reaching another even higher level in the 4k challenge...and _when_ this might happen...well, hard to beat at this moment I'd say! :-)
rulezadded on the 2002-09-07 03:27:56 by Weasel Weasel
nice
rulezadded on the 2002-09-07 09:38:30 by raimo raimo
rulez! although u should make it work in all windows versions in 4k
rulezadded on the 2002-09-07 21:06:35 by mac mac
4k version works on my machine, but only in a window. nice stuff. not artsy or anything, but technically impressive.
added on the 2002-09-08 09:39:02 by bhead bhead
That's a fine one. Looks good is small and has nice music for the size. :) Get it.
superb design and execution! beautiful music.

concerning the "import by ordinal" trick, i don't like that. i mean, a 4k that only runs on win2k or only on winme or whatever is probably alright... but an intro that breaks when you install a service pack? come on... that's a bit too fragile for my taste.
rulezadded on the 2002-09-13 05:55:15 by jazzman jazzman
thanks for all the comments.
some comments on comments anyway:

4k-size:
the 4k version works in the given context, so "13k intro" etc. is not true. most of you know that is just some arbitrary windowish numbering-shit that has to do NOTHING, with algorithmic complexity.

200 byte shrinking (abductee):
not confirmed. add 200 byte, remove them. is that shrinking ?

relaying on dll (ryg):
there is no qualitative difference if you link your 64k against a multi-megabyte-directx of a given version-range or if you link a 4k against a certain dll.

dynamic lighting (hellfire):
the lighting is not dynamic.

import by name (macaw):
it is simply not true and i do not think that i need advise, certainly not concerning code, from your side. i had a look at your import code and had a good laugh. maybe this works for you and your flatshaded context but fact is that there are 106 imports concerning the gfx-code only that sum up to 1800 byte character data.

only cubes:
this is much of a simplififcation to arbitrary geometry. without it i think it would not be possible. in fact this is not really what most of you know as R3 in "3D" anymore. a normal reduces to an index in 6 directions, the innner product turns into some sort of select-operation and much more.

the comment i like the most is that the visuals are "dull".
added on the 2002-09-15 14:10:51 by noize noize
laugh away noize, but the fact remains - you jump into fixed addresses in memory - hoping for it to be valid (+ my initcode has proven to work on all windows 95,98,2k,xp,me platforms with opengl).
oh yeh, additionally one could say that you're linking with far too much if you need 1800bytes of import-char-data for what you need of opengl...
.com and .exe dont work
winMe + P4_1.8G + GF4200ti
Quote:
the 4k version works in the given context, so "13k intro" etc. is not true. most of you know that is just some arbitrary windowish numbering-shit that has to do NOTHING, with algorithmic complexity.


well yes, but algorithmic complexity doesn't really matter in 4ks anyway. it's about making good use of every single byte, and that involves a lot of low-level trickery rather than algorithmic changes.

that said, windows is a pretty thankless platform for a 4k. on other platforms you know what you're coding against - hard&software base is clearly defined. a windows pc (or a linux pc for that matter) is something of a moving target.
added on the 2002-11-27 19:42:03 by jazzman jazzman
Clean, smooth. I enjoyed.
added on the 2002-12-10 05:03:21 by ukuk ukuk
Couldn't not get working in none of the 4 pc's that I've tested on
added on the 2003-01-23 02:20:49 by shash shash

moody lighting..

rulezadded on the 2003-02-12 07:02:55 by raver raver
fantastic! I liked the way you could see it walking through the patches gathering/shooting....

to people who say it's not 4k: that's bullshit. you simply can't complain about people linking to dll's - by ordinal or by text. people are only whinging here because it's rarely discussed and they probably didn't realise it was happening before. without dll linking, there could be no win32 demos at all. so. this is definitely a 4k demo - it doesn't break any (sane) rules! end of story!

as to the stability of linking against numbers, that is a shame. it runs on several SP's over here - though a lot of people quit before the initial precalc has finished (I did the first time...). I wonder how many people who can't get it to run on pouet, just didn't wait long enough. try again...

maybe if the kolor boys get a free moment, they could build a (>4k) version with string function names for us radeon owners... then surely that would silence all the ranters :)
rulezadded on the 2003-02-20 18:27:14 by bluespoon bluespoon
BB Image
added on the 2003-02-22 17:47:32 by dipswitch dipswitch
At the beginning, I thought it would suck, cause I can do cubes too ;P
But it's more interesting. Radiosity, ehh??? (Whatever this is,. but moody lightnings as Raver said before me, is what it shows it off..)
Do they calculate radiosity for only specific points in a grid and not every pixel, and then just interpolate the colors in beetween with the 3d card? Clever..
added on the 2003-02-24 15:15:32 by Optimus Optimus
fixing misunderstandings:
- the lighting is not dynamic, it's static.
- probably it's not realtime , because of quite long loading time and there's no need for it being realtime (much more clever to calculate shadows to textures)

what comes to this intro, it's surely my new favourite 4k (great musics, nice colours+lighting -> that's enough)
rulezadded on the 2003-03-17 20:47:25 by shadez shadez
DOH!
rulezadded on the 2003-04-04 22:55:56 by knl knl
sharp.
rulezadded on the 2003-04-04 23:39:45 by kimi kandler kimi kandler
shadez: it is realtime. the "loading" time is spent precalculating the music completely :)
added on the 2003-04-05 18:04:58 by ryg ryg
ryg: the shading isn't realtime, it's calculated while the camera moves in the scene. shadez is right, the lighting is static.

calculating the music completelly? the intro takes 100mb of ram here, i guess some other stuff is calculated and stored in memory during loading.

anyway, global illumination in 4k rocks :-).
added on the 2003-04-05 18:14:20 by nystep nystep
I forgot to nitoce that only the 4k version works correctly here, the 13k version crashes in the end...
added on the 2003-04-05 18:23:29 by nystep nystep
nystep: er, what exactly about calculating the lighting while the scene is being shown is non-realtime? i never claimed it was dynamic.
added on the 2003-04-06 16:35:40 by ryg ryg
making a lightmap calculation while you are travelling for 10 (let's assume) seconds means the lighting routine runs at 0,1 fps.. while the camera shows the intermediary result in a smooth way.
added on the 2003-04-06 23:49:06 by nystep nystep
Finally I could watch this one on a friend's computer. I expected more from this one, but I wouldn't say it sux :P
added on the 2003-05-03 16:52:30 by shash shash
nystep, and what's so non-realtime about 0.1fps?

don't confuse "realtime" with "fast", please :)
added on the 2003-05-03 17:38:27 by ryg ryg
dipswitch: nice picture. i love it!!!
good rendering of a skylight'like :)
rulezadded on the 2003-06-26 14:50:49 by Zone (leZone) Zone (leZone)
i like it . . .
rulezadded on the 2003-10-28 08:37:42 by freed_ohm freed_ohm
Clean, and pleasant.
It reminds me the cubes scenes in Little Nell
rulezadded on the 2004-02-05 06:48:58 by p01 p01
:)
rulezadded on the 2004-07-30 12:38:12 by meCh\bps meCh\bps
;P
rulezadded on the 2004-07-31 02:40:40 by las las
woohoo!
rulezadded on the 2005-01-16 22:03:53 by eye eye
well, i love this 4k
but, importing by ordinals really sucks
thus no thumb this time
added on the 2005-01-16 22:25:42 by blala blala
interesting idea, bringing algorithmic complexity to 4ks.
rulezadded on the 2005-01-25 16:35:14 by mizc mizc
How could I forget to leave a thumb on this great 4k? /o\
rulezadded on the 2005-01-26 02:04:58 by René Madenmann René Madenmann
intro rulez. as along as it works here - importing by ordinals rulez too :)
rulezadded on the 2005-03-09 18:52:19 by beton beton
zieeeeeew
sucksadded on the 2005-05-16 20:00:07 by kempy kempy
Beauty
rulezadded on the 2005-05-16 20:20:00 by Preacher Preacher
Great work!
rulezadded on the 2005-09-16 05:03:45 by ALiEN^bf ALiEN^bf
Simply.
rulezadded on the 2005-10-07 01:09:02 by bdk bdk
this looks great in the video. is there music in the actual demo. strange 30seconds of black at the end of the movie..
rulezadded on the 2005-12-15 04:09:40 by dila dila
Nice mood music alongside radiosity. Nice colours. Technically way better than it is rated I think. Cool size coding.
rulezadded on the 2006-04-06 07:02:51 by wroceng wroceng
Looks great. Relaxing, but bordering with boring, so piggy...
added on the 2006-07-14 20:30:56 by exocet exocet
rulezadded on the 2006-07-14 20:56:26 by Tron Swanson Tron Swanson
rulezadded on the 2006-08-09 14:43:13 by wie8 wie8
Great
rulezadded on the 2006-09-10 05:13:01 by Buckethead Buckethead
added on the 2007-01-03 22:54:23 by thec thec
:)
rulezadded on the 2007-01-03 22:59:11 by texel texel
I like it.
rulezadded on the 2007-01-03 23:17:54 by raer raer
<3
rulezadded on the 2007-01-03 23:51:24 by nagato^ nagato^
rulezadded on the 2007-01-24 21:26:08 by 9M4N 9M4N
Fantastic lighting combined with nice design a cool tune. Great work! Thumb up!
rulezadded on the 2007-05-10 15:41:20 by Admiral^Elyssis Admiral^Elyssis
virtual light
rulezadded on the 2008-04-13 18:23:24 by 0rel 0rel
Great stuff!
rulezadded on the 2008-07-03 13:29:00 by d3pth d3pth
ace. very.
rulezadded on the 2009-05-15 14:38:14 by spike spike
Watched it again. Nice idea to use an iterative approach to solve only a part of the energy transport and sell it as an effect ;)
added on the 2010-09-06 12:52:57 by raer raer
I don't dig the direction, but the rendering is quite neat.
rulezadded on the 2011-05-17 16:57:26 by Zavie Zavie
a 4k which doesn't get old.. impressive stuff!
rulezadded on the 2011-05-17 17:23:46 by mad mad
Mmmm!
rulezadded on the 2011-05-17 21:21:36 by rutra80 rutra80
scary
rulezadded on the 2011-12-14 21:43:40 by Frequent Frequent
Amazing :D
rulezadded on the 2012-01-12 21:55:42 by rez rez
wow
rulezadded on the 2012-09-02 17:53:55 by provod provod
again
rulezadded on the 2013-03-20 23:37:52 by noby noby

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