pouët.net

SceneCity - privacy-focussed live streaming and chat for the demoscene

category: general [glöplog]
Introducing the SceneCity public beta

Don't want your private data to be owned by Discord or Twitch?

SceneCity is a new platform for the Demoscene, providing chat and video streaming services. Our services are strictly non-commercial and very much focused on privacy. You only need your SceneID to be part of the show.

We are providing free streaming channels to any demoparty, and chat public channels for your party, country, language or group.

Apps are available for all major platforms, and you can even join via IRC.

Read more about SceneCity at:
https://scenecity.site

Check the live streams at:
https://scenecity.tv

Only SceneCity is streaming Revision in ULTRA Quality (20 MBit/s) - let's see how long it takes until the servers explode after this announcement ;)

We are also exclusively streaming the satellite parties Undergrond Conference, Comparade and ReACtion.

Please note: There right now (Friday) often is tons of stuttering on the stream - this is not a problem with the streaming server or your Internet connection, but a problem at Revision Online itself, which is also seen on their official servers. They are working VERY hard to get this fixed ASAP.
added on the 2022-04-15 18:53:32 by scamp scamp
Privacy? I see google.com, dns.google.com ?
added on the 2022-04-15 20:06:41 by leGend leGend
Stream works well and the technical presentation is very nice.

As said in the other threat about "Discord vs Nerdherrschaft" - A decentral solution would be recommended with more independent working systems to have a real neutral base. but to offering streaming and hosting such things is a good thing.
added on the 2022-04-15 20:09:35 by AMI_TRS AMI_TRS
Where are you seeing this?

There is no google.com anywhere in any of the parts of the website. And dns.google.com is a DNS resolver, how should that be part of a website?
added on the 2022-04-15 20:10:23 by scamp scamp
AMI_TRS: This is not a Nerdherrschaft product. It's created by a bunch of sceners who have no relation to Nerdherrschaft.

Yeah, for now all of this is running on Nerdherrschaft servers, and the apps are also signed by Nerdherrschaft.

But there is no requirement of this being permanent. As explained on the website, moderators/mediators are to be democratically elected.

And we are looking for additional widely-trusted sceners with a server administration background to take over maintenance, and we would also love more coders to join the team - the list of feature requests after the first week is already VERY long :)

And finally: At a certain point I would prefer all of this being taken over by a established scene non-profit, with Nerdherrschaft only doing the sponsoring.

TL;DR: Not a power grab. This is done out of love, not for egos.
added on the 2022-04-15 20:15:53 by scamp scamp
Scamp: I logged via id.scene.org, then there was µblock origin showing those being blocked. o_O I have not used google on this browser ever.
added on the 2022-04-15 20:20:17 by leGend leGend
view-source:https://id.scene.org/

It's scene.org using google.

Please check our source code or check your network monitor. SceneCity does not do a single request to ANYWHERE other than SceneCity.
added on the 2022-04-15 20:25:19 by scamp scamp
That is good to know.
added on the 2022-04-15 23:15:58 by leGend leGend
thank you
added on the 2022-04-15 23:52:41 by wullon wullon
thumb up!
added on the 2022-04-16 09:03:27 by Asato Asato
I used mumble and teamspeak when demoparties were still mainly chatting with IRC. Honestly, I was on voice chat for almost five years straight and really never want to experience that again. I loved it, but it's not the real thing and you start to burn out! (my opinion) I know a lot was using teamspeak and also skype already (which I did not like much because it 'stunk'). When the ds switched to Discord I was shocked. WTF! - This crappy program? Is this really the scene? Why not mumble? It was free, small, technically up to date and encrypted almost 20 years ago. Since I haven't used Discord, I've been spared the big drama and don't care as much as possible. Yesterday I visited scenecity and it felt good. So sorry that I don't go along with every hype and have principles and therefore became rather the lone wolf. There, done. God luck with the project. Voice and video chat update could be a next step, then VR with sex, gangsterrap battles and boxing matches. Thank you.
added on the 2022-04-16 09:48:35 by aqu aqu
Quote:
It's scene.org using google.

To be clear we only use it for the Prototype CDN, tho to be honest we could probably get rid of it.
added on the 2022-04-16 23:06:22 by Gargaj Gargaj
Always good to get rid of Google. I was using Google Analytics before, solely because I was interested that is anyone actually using the services I host. Recently I made the effort to remove all that in favor of self hosted Plausible for stats. I could probable do away with loading JS/CSS from Cloudflare CDN but I am yet to classify CF as a bad actor.
added on the 2022-04-17 11:48:51 by T-101 T-101
Gargaj: I also do not think it's an issue at all that you do - after all the only thing google will "know" is - "this guy logged in using sceneid". It would be a completely different thing if we had Google on our side, with google getting to know each link you click in our chat etc - that would be a privacy issue.

But yeah, probably some people would be happier if Google is not used on scene.org either.
added on the 2022-04-17 12:15:38 by scamp scamp
THIS is a great initiative in every possible way <3
added on the 2022-04-17 23:13:05 by response response
Quote:
Don't want your private data to be owned by Discord or Twitch?


What private data are we talking about?
I've changed SceneID to locally host Prototype rather than on the CDN (which I'll eventually replace with just raw JS), but now I noticed the Google fonts too :(
added on the 2022-04-18 10:25:02 by Gargaj Gargaj
guardian:

https://discord.com/privacy
https://www.twitch.tv/p/en/legal/privacy-notice/#personal-information-twitch-collects-about-you

Personally I am not privacy-paranoid, happy to use Google services etc- but the idea of a US corporation storing all chat messages I have ever written is not something I like. The privacy laws in the UC are simply very weak.

Fun fact: Last week I tried to delete my Discord account. In total violation of EU GDPR laws, there is no way to actually have your data deleted instantly. Instead they give you a waiting period of 14 days, and during that time you are still displayed as being online, so people are still writing to you, and you can't notify them "I am no longer here", causing you to log in again, which breaks the waiting cycle. They make it as hard as possible to leave the platform.
added on the 2022-04-18 12:09:23 by scamp scamp
Cheers, I'll do that later.
added on the 2022-04-18 12:34:13 by Gargaj Gargaj
That's done now.
added on the 2022-04-18 13:04:51 by Gargaj Gargaj
Gargaj: Great, thanks!
added on the 2022-04-18 17:04:12 by scamp scamp
Hi,

thank you all for the wonderful weekend. It was nice to see that all the hard work paid off, and that the system already worked reasonably well. The world-wide streaming server system still has some bugs when it comes to keeping a shared timebase, but also turned out to be more stable than expected.

If you think SceneCity is a project that deserves support, here is what you can do:

- Are you a Golang coder? The Mattermost chat system we are based on is written in Go, and is rather clean code to work with. We have a lot of feature requests and stuff we can do to make this further "scene-centric".

- Are you a C++ coder? The Streaming Server system is written in C++. Again, there would be some further improvements that could be done.

- You are Typescript/Web hipster guy? 2b did an amazing work bringing the Apps to Android and iOS. but again, there is more to do.

- Just having a platform is only the start. We need to start building communities. Are you interested in opening and building a community in a dedicated chat channel? This could be based on a topic, a demoparty, or a language. Building a community is real work that needs patience and love.

- If you are a demo party who wishes to either get away from Twitch or at least provide an alternative to your online viewers, contact us to have your streaming channel created.

- Are you willing to contribute to our "demo loop"? We are looking for HIGH QUALITY captures of demoscene productions, and for someone willing to provide meta-data (basic info about the entry) that we can display prior to each entry on the screen.

- Spread the word and try to unite the scene. Right now people are spread over on IRC, Discord, Slack and other platforms, and it's rather hard to find a place where you can reach all of our community.

- Are you part of a non-profit demoscene organization? We need to get rid of that "I am not using a great technical platform because scamp was involved"-shit, and focus on what this platform enables. It therefore would help to find a established scene non-profit to take over chairmanship.

- Do you wish to help develop our community policies? Our plan is that we try to keep moderation to an absolute limit, and instead try to establish mediation. This is planned to be based on democratic elections for the big/major channels, while the smaller ones should be moderated by whatever community has built it. The focus on the policies should NOT be to try to limit what you can say, the focus shall be on how to make sure very early on that the communities are healthy and nobody gets hurt.


There is probably more. Again, for now this is just a technical platform. It's up to the scene to decide if they wish to fill it with life.
added on the 2022-04-18 17:15:54 by scamp scamp
Scenecity has a lot of potential. I love it.
added on the 2022-04-18 19:01:43 by _docd^hjb _docd^hjb
I am not a hipster guy. But anyway: nice project, respect!
added on the 2022-04-18 21:01:01 by ghandy ghandy

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