Sincere apologies
category: general [glöplog]
paniqs words:
Which I already told I appreciated. A very good bi-effect is that people can listen even to the preselected tracks on headsets / own sound systems. Well produced stuff comes out better this way as most party sound systems generally makes many not-so-impressive tracks sound "great" anyway.
Quote:
i introduced party streams on the ultimate meeting where i organize the ogg/mp3 music competition.
Which I already told I appreciated. A very good bi-effect is that people can listen even to the preselected tracks on headsets / own sound systems. Well produced stuff comes out better this way as most party sound systems generally makes many not-so-impressive tracks sound "great" anyway.
I wonder if would see some gravity-defying action gemini took his attitude to the logical extreme..
+if
Even if i don`t have the best relationship with nosfe here on pouet.net, i must say that he has a very valid point. And who could blame nosfe for his actions?
i can't understand 216's sentence, even with the extra 'if', i must be too tired?
yay for zplex!
yay for zplex!
nosfe: don't let your art be raped by giving explanations for your art and action. Art has no meaning. It appears that nowadays the audience want to be pleased by britney spears-like mainstream things with cheapo tricks that work over art and creative concepts.
And this for the demo compo and everything surrounding it.
There is no pleasure to simply create something without waiting for something back. Just look at the number of quality productions out of parties.
NONE.
Everything is done for the bigscreen and the audience, and thus for the fame.
However there are still -some- prods that will survive the time when the pure technical side will be obsolete because they have been done with a real cultural and almost philosophical influences in mind.
I said some (u know who u are), so don't except me to give names. It would be unrespectuous.
Only time will say what is art or not.
And this for the demo compo and everything surrounding it.
There is no pleasure to simply create something without waiting for something back. Just look at the number of quality productions out of parties.
NONE.
Everything is done for the bigscreen and the audience, and thus for the fame.
However there are still -some- prods that will survive the time when the pure technical side will be obsolete because they have been done with a real cultural and almost philosophical influences in mind.
I said some (u know who u are), so don't except me to give names. It would be unrespectuous.
Only time will say what is art or not.
nosfe, there's a fair chance that dragging drunken people out of a demoparty requires violence. that kind of fascist action can not be tolerated.
i understand now.
from now on we should allow drunken people to do whatever they like, cause it's fascism to not let them to do so.
from now on we should allow drunken people to do whatever they like, cause it's fascism to not let them to do so.
btw, i kindof missed the second bigscreen wich you could watch from outside... if it was one like that, this would prolly not happen.....
nosfe: you should have gone to the organizers and asked them to take action. it would be the decent thing to do.
and yeah, i'd much rather be a guy who disses someone's production than someone who uses any kind of violence.
well, mostly when people get thrown out it happends without violence. people seem to respect when organizers ask them to leave the party. if they don't it is ok to use force if the person itself resists, in the same manner as it is ok for the police to use force to keep society in order.
and yeah, i'd much rather be a guy who disses someone's production than someone who uses any kind of violence.
well, mostly when people get thrown out it happends without violence. people seem to respect when organizers ask them to leave the party. if they don't it is ok to use force if the person itself resists, in the same manner as it is ok for the police to use force to keep society in order.
i thought the police was the root of all fascism.
stefan: it's not like i'm some kind of leftish guy :P
besides, i do understand why nosfe got angry. but due to the fact that he didnt protest the fact that people were on stage when the other contribution was shown, he had no right to protest that people were on stage when his contribution was shown. that's the first error.
the second error is the violence used.
but it all wouldn't have been an issue if kb hadn't encouraged people to go on stage, so that's the third error.
now an apology from nosfe too, and we're all set. ok?
besides, i do understand why nosfe got angry. but due to the fact that he didnt protest the fact that people were on stage when the other contribution was shown, he had no right to protest that people were on stage when his contribution was shown. that's the first error.
the second error is the violence used.
but it all wouldn't have been an issue if kb hadn't encouraged people to go on stage, so that's the third error.
now an apology from nosfe too, and we're all set. ok?
his art video was all about him being sorry to kick some guys asses if they didnt like it and fucked it while running.
so he was one step ahead of you... or left?
so he was one step ahead of you... or left?
gemini, i did yell quite a lot to the fuckers who were on the stage during kosmoplovci. which helped nothing. and i did yell in anger when they stopped showing kosmoplovcis video, which helped nothing.
for what i saw the organisers were quite ok with the shit what was going on.
i don't apologise when i haven't done anything wrong. and what, so far the only people from those who were on stage who came up to me were couple of guys apologising from me. none of one has asked me to apologise from them, and why should they do that, they know themselves that they are sorry ass motherfuckers who were drunk and who didn't know what they were doing.
and you talk about violence, show a person who got hurt there.
don't you fucking get it, the people were on the stage because organisers had given them encouragement to do so, why would i have any kind of belief that going to beg from organisers would have helped anything? i am not a fucking sheep.
your beliefs of working things out through authorities makes it quite clear what kind of political systems you are after.
for what i saw the organisers were quite ok with the shit what was going on.
i don't apologise when i haven't done anything wrong. and what, so far the only people from those who were on stage who came up to me were couple of guys apologising from me. none of one has asked me to apologise from them, and why should they do that, they know themselves that they are sorry ass motherfuckers who were drunk and who didn't know what they were doing.
and you talk about violence, show a person who got hurt there.
don't you fucking get it, the people were on the stage because organisers had given them encouragement to do so, why would i have any kind of belief that going to beg from organisers would have helped anything? i am not a fucking sheep.
your beliefs of working things out through authorities makes it quite clear what kind of political systems you are after.
gemini's words do scare me abit..
atleast try to understand the motives behind the peoples action before repressing them with blind authority. specially if you're a partyorganizer, you're supposed to be more openminded to any potential situation and attempt to reason with people to discover their motives, not just impose your authority to get everything working as you wish it would be.
atleast try to understand the motives behind the peoples action before repressing them with blind authority. specially if you're a partyorganizer, you're supposed to be more openminded to any potential situation and attempt to reason with people to discover their motives, not just impose your authority to get everything working as you wish it would be.
mmmh....
well nosfe, i wanted to add: you've had reactions such as organizers wanting to shut down your stuff twice now, but your 2004 entry for tum was an exception. why? because it had content and it made neurons fire.
i doubt that you dont understand why people react the way they do - in a scientific sense, not in a "because they are stupid" sense.
i also believe that you actually want to get a few brains to enlightenment, at least bring something enjoyable and positive to human minds.
i recently read an article in a neurology magazine about boredom. they wrote that specific neurons, if triggered for a longer time, start firing less and less, so that neurons which are not that active get more attention. e.g. staring at a white light for some time gives you a black hole in your view when looking at something else, because the neurons for "brightness" are tired from firing.
looking at one of your entries raises my brain activity for about 30 seconds. then neural activity subsides and there is nothing to understand or grasp instead of the same logical pattern. at this point, i have already understood the structure and the "system" of the thousand images that follow - everything that i see is just another manifestation of the same principle you introduced at the beginning. therefore low neural activity, no stimulus, hence my attention is drawn elsewhere.
there is a small minority in the audience that is not like me but more like you. its the kind of people that can have a lot of fun with 60 minutes of white noise, but i'm not coming to a party for meditation. i stay at home for that.
at tum 2004 you made a real short video clip that was a lot more enjoyable than what you usually do, yes, i really see a pattern there... its slow, abstract, ambient, unstable.
i therefore voted your entry as "SUCKS" this time, because i want you to do something different. you work way below your capabilities.
if you cant get over your thickheadedness and rather prefer to play some silly social games with normal people like me, i hope that there is still a plan behind it to change everything for the better.
btw, i've made stuff that is pretty similar to what you did, but i only show it to people who really want to listen to it. i dont submit this to parties. i dont want to insult anyone, including myself.
well nosfe, i wanted to add: you've had reactions such as organizers wanting to shut down your stuff twice now, but your 2004 entry for tum was an exception. why? because it had content and it made neurons fire.
i doubt that you dont understand why people react the way they do - in a scientific sense, not in a "because they are stupid" sense.
i also believe that you actually want to get a few brains to enlightenment, at least bring something enjoyable and positive to human minds.
i recently read an article in a neurology magazine about boredom. they wrote that specific neurons, if triggered for a longer time, start firing less and less, so that neurons which are not that active get more attention. e.g. staring at a white light for some time gives you a black hole in your view when looking at something else, because the neurons for "brightness" are tired from firing.
looking at one of your entries raises my brain activity for about 30 seconds. then neural activity subsides and there is nothing to understand or grasp instead of the same logical pattern. at this point, i have already understood the structure and the "system" of the thousand images that follow - everything that i see is just another manifestation of the same principle you introduced at the beginning. therefore low neural activity, no stimulus, hence my attention is drawn elsewhere.
there is a small minority in the audience that is not like me but more like you. its the kind of people that can have a lot of fun with 60 minutes of white noise, but i'm not coming to a party for meditation. i stay at home for that.
at tum 2004 you made a real short video clip that was a lot more enjoyable than what you usually do, yes, i really see a pattern there... its slow, abstract, ambient, unstable.
i therefore voted your entry as "SUCKS" this time, because i want you to do something different. you work way below your capabilities.
if you cant get over your thickheadedness and rather prefer to play some silly social games with normal people like me, i hope that there is still a plan behind it to change everything for the better.
btw, i've made stuff that is pretty similar to what you did, but i only show it to people who really want to listen to it. i dont submit this to parties. i dont want to insult anyone, including myself.
normal people like me
hehe. :D
hehe. :D
paniq, my entries have been shut down a lot more than twice.
i am well aware that it's only a minority that likes the stuff that i do.
but i am not willing to accept the way that some people think that demoscene as a platform for creative things should be aimed only to entertain the majority of people involved with in it. you don't have to like things that are different from 3d gfx card speed tests, but atleast you should respect the fact that other people see them worthwhile to do. the idea that only the tastes of majority should be respected is something i find completely disgusting.
and yes, the voting is a good way to say your opinion of a production. and so is booing after the entry has been shown.
demoparties are such happenings that short break of meditation wouldn't hurt anyone. it doesn't all have to be coffeine overdosed drunkness, you know.
the thing i did for tum was a study work where i was required to do something with a script, i currently have no intrest in continuing with anything like that. i'm well aware that things like that would be something that people would rather see, and that i would get higher places in compo results with them. but i am not here to please you.
i am well aware that it's only a minority that likes the stuff that i do.
but i am not willing to accept the way that some people think that demoscene as a platform for creative things should be aimed only to entertain the majority of people involved with in it. you don't have to like things that are different from 3d gfx card speed tests, but atleast you should respect the fact that other people see them worthwhile to do. the idea that only the tastes of majority should be respected is something i find completely disgusting.
and yes, the voting is a good way to say your opinion of a production. and so is booing after the entry has been shown.
demoparties are such happenings that short break of meditation wouldn't hurt anyone. it doesn't all have to be coffeine overdosed drunkness, you know.
the thing i did for tum was a study work where i was required to do something with a script, i currently have no intrest in continuing with anything like that. i'm well aware that things like that would be something that people would rather see, and that i would get higher places in compo results with them. but i am not here to please you.
nosfe: i agree with the demoparties and the short break of meditation. in various ways. heh heh.
good point with the last question, but: if youre not here to please us, why should we please you?
good point with the last question, but: if youre not here to please us, why should we please you?
paniq: please get your head out of your ass.
long exposure to a loop bares diferent results then short exposure. why should progressive ambient/noise be restricted to short exposure when the message we want to deliver requires long one?
to please the audience?
fuck the audience.
if we wanted to please the audience we wouldnt be doing the experimental stuff we enjoy doing.
"why should we please you?"
ARE YOU FUCKING RETARDED? we do demos to show creativity not entertainment. why should we please you? if you dont want to witness creativity from others stay the fuck away from the hall during the compo. IT'S A MATTER OF MOTHERFUCKING _RESPECT_, BOTH THE AUTHOR AND THE REST OF THE AUDIENCE.
do you go to a movie to boo when you dont like the editing? no, you leave the damn movie hall, if you got any decency you try not to ruin the experience for the other people who do care, and you defnitly dont do it no the premiere when the makers are present.
forgive me for my rude words, im pissed with other stuff and tired of this bullshit discussion.
long exposure to a loop bares diferent results then short exposure. why should progressive ambient/noise be restricted to short exposure when the message we want to deliver requires long one?
to please the audience?
fuck the audience.
if we wanted to please the audience we wouldnt be doing the experimental stuff we enjoy doing.
"why should we please you?"
ARE YOU FUCKING RETARDED? we do demos to show creativity not entertainment. why should we please you? if you dont want to witness creativity from others stay the fuck away from the hall during the compo. IT'S A MATTER OF MOTHERFUCKING _RESPECT_, BOTH THE AUTHOR AND THE REST OF THE AUDIENCE.
do you go to a movie to boo when you dont like the editing? no, you leave the damn movie hall, if you got any decency you try not to ruin the experience for the other people who do care, and you defnitly dont do it no the premiere when the makers are present.
forgive me for my rude words, im pissed with other stuff and tired of this bullshit discussion.
well, considering it's a "competition", pleasing someone shouldn't be an utterly strange concept...
let's just try to be patient and watch the entries. one can clap, boo or simply talk to the next guy about something else.
kb's way wasn't the best one, which we all know very well he realised a dozen times in hindsight. now we all know this for the next time.
kb's way wasn't the best one, which we all know very well he realised a dozen times in hindsight. now we all know this for the next time.
perhaps demoparties should start separating the visual entertainment into competition and screening out of competition, like on movie festivals. (of course, with free decision of where to take part, but in competition there should be preselection and in out of competition none). or smth.
anyway, i totally felt with nosfe when he was throwing those fuckers off stage.
anyway, i totally felt with nosfe when he was throwing those fuckers off stage.
if ep were here he would tell you that the solution is easy: just ban alcohol (no more drunken people) and stop using black backgrounds (no more violence)!
ps, thanks for derailing the discussion from it's senseful and organized manner.