pouët.net

Scamp: you're so going to regret this quote once the pictures made during one of the band performances (don't remember which one) are released ;-)

Awsome party as usual. Now I need a week of Rehab!

Nothing to compain about this time either really, except the usual things that come with theese events. Secondhand smoking and the sanetary thing.

(Hey, how about making smokers that break the no-smoking rule, clean the toilet :D There you go, eliminating atleast one of the problems.)

Ok, here comes a rant from a non-smoker (but used to have smoking parents so I'm not totally out in the blue from your point of view):

scamp, yes, people smoke at the table lotsoftimes. Just becuase you don't have problems with the smoke you cant deny the fact that I can smell it and feel it as soon as someone lights a cigarette 10 meters away from me. Outside that is alright cause I can walk away, but sitting by my computer it makes it hard to move around each time someone lights a cig.

Kudos for the people who gladly ashed their cigs when I asked them to, much appriciated.

Sparcus: it's suddenly an issue because I suddenly came home from breakpoint with the sudden impression that something might need to be done about this. Last years I haven't had a computer with me and spent most time outside or moving around, but this year I actually wanted to spend some quality time coding - too. I seriously doubt that we are few that feels this way, and if you don't feel like speaking out in public, you could at least get your voice heard in the forms which usuallly scamp sends out after the party.

And if it's really a "small number of smokers". Why can't the 10% respect the other 90%? And don't fuck up the numbers, there were constantly 5-10ppl standing in the tunnel smoking (which screwed up the grandstand quite a bit), but I could easily count more than that sitting by their computers smoking at the end (sat-sun) of the party. That hardly make it 99%...

And for a final note, yes I do want to sit in the grandstand because I can't stand the fucking BASS being played and the bigscreen in the tent didn't work for the compos (which we tried to watch from there first actually...)

Scamp: Please take any actions you want, it's your party, but please don't ignore the problem with smoke, the dangers of it and don't compare it with a ugly mat or some bad aroma, my eyes doesn't bleed from this (yet, the carpet need a few more years for that ;-)

Thank you once again for a great party, I will be back, smoke or not, but it would mean a lot to me and others in my company if it would be fixed.

Look closely:

thec:

Understood. However, the fair solution is to ask you not to stand in the smoking areas. Asking the smokers to completely leave to location just to have a cigarette is not reasonable in comparison. They already have to walk everytime they want to smoke. You don't have to walk to enjoy sitting in a non-smoking area.

Regarding health stuff: If you want to live healthy, go to a forest, not a demoparty. A demoparty is full of bacteria, virii, noise damaging your ears, lights damaging your eyes, food damaging your stomach, lack of sleep damaging your heart and alcohol damaging your brain cells. The additional slice of cancer from passive smoking doesn't make much of a change :)

wonder if there could be an actual and true no smoking area at bp then? say the right side of the hall? or something.. kinda like "we know you're going to smoke in the hall even tho we say its forbidden, so when you do so please atleast don't smoke at this end of the hall".. dunno if it could work..

I don't know if it has been already discussed but... is it allowed to smoke inside IF having an ashtray ? (Or a empty can of beer or something...)

Popular demand (as reported in the last years as not properly working):
When being outside there's no way to get information on running compos or seminars. Please come up with a solution that displays events that'll soon start or even run at the moment. An LED scroller like Eha's ("Kommt alle zur Wired 98!") shouldn't be that expensive.

Scamp: When so many countries has managed quite successfully to introduce anti-smoking laws that forbids smoking in all bars, restaurants and night clubs, why should it be impossible to do this at demo parties as well? For me it's not about the health, but the inability to wear the same pants for two days in a row because they smell like cigarettes. When traveling half way around Europe, that's a bit annoying.

Madenmann: That's what the jingles are for. Still: Yeah, this could be improved. Sadly an outside video projector won't work during daylight. We'll put it onto our "what's left to improve" list.

Evil: No.

A few thoughts from someone who also smokes heavily (but is in the process of giving it up).

Scamp is absolutely right. If you want to bring up comfort issues, start with a thousand smelly, disgusting sceners spilling beer, vomiting, throwing stuff around, being outright violent at times, playing crappy music because they think it's "fun" and then turning up the volume because they think being annoying is also "fun". Then consider that not everyone might enjoy watching others enjoy watching scat. Next look at the toilets. I mean, WTF! How hard can it be to take a shit? The list of uncomfortable aspects of parties goes on and on, and yes, smoking is on it - somewhere.

Apparently it's also a health issue for some people. While I'm all in favour of life and all that, it's just rich to hear people complaining about the hazards of smoke while sitting in front of a computer likely going on 8 hours of physical inactivity, considering their next yearly visit to one of the most unsanitary places on Earth, where they get to sleep on the floor, drink poison, and eat Currywurst till they drop down unconscious in someone else's vomit. Someone, one could add, who has lots of otherwise regional diseases to spread, in addition to all the generic bacteria and fungi who also tagged along to enjoy that great party atmosphere at Breakpoint. The main reason people today tend to live past their 30s is hygiene, and that's the one thing you won't find at a party.

I mean, with all the things that have been killing the scene these past 15 years, it's only fair that it gets to kill you right back. If you don't want to let it, you should start with a little perspective.

kusma: "quite successfully"?

The one and only true answer. The smokers were not that oppressively present this year. Sure, they broke the rules here and there, but not annoyingly so. It's been worse at the previous Breakpoints.

Last year the Finns brought a particular nasty flu to Breakpoint that left a lot of people incapacitated after BP. Shall we ban the Finns for that? I know that people who pretend to live in a bubble get all riled up about the idea of smoke everywhere (I *insist* people do not smoke in my bedroom too), but a demoparty is not a sterile place. Kusma probably got more toxins in his pants watching the TBL demo that beat his GBA demo than cigarrette smoke (let alone the fireplace).

Actually a random portugese scener (not Jeenio) did the same thing at Numerica ;-)

scamp: Sadly I can't hear the jingles at the bonfire when f.e. sobec is playing a DJ set at the second stage.

Oh come on. Comparing smoking to nerds with bad hygiene is just stupid. It's a scientific fact that smoke damages even bystanders. Besides it shouldn't be too hard to walk that few meters to the smoking area even if you spend all your day on your computer with physical inactivity.

Now, personally, I couldn't care less. I don't smoke myself, but I've got so used to the smoke that it doesn't bother me. Neither do I care about its health effects, especially at a demoparty. Still many people do mind it. Is it really so hard for smokers to accept that and at least try be polite towards those people?

Disclaimer: Oh, and I wasn't present at BP this year (damn airlines charging too much money, *grmbl*), so I have no clue how bad it was.

So pandemics happen through magic? Sorry, you lose the argument over the internet here -not just be not even being there. Currywurst kills people, you know.

Yeah, but you're not harming the guy next to you when you eat your currywurst.

teel: You can shrug it off all you want, but life in a very filthy environment will be shorter than life with even first-hand smoke. The comparison is entirely relevant, and a bit of second-hand smoke is not what you should be worrying about at parties if your health is a priority.

As to whether or not it's annoying, well, so were the DJs. Many people (including myself) find excessively loud house music to be really invasive and unpleasant. Having me walk through a rave fest just to get from where the power is to where the food is (and to where you apparently want me to smoke) is not polite. I can cope though. The way smokers are being treated these days teaches you to value tolerance.

Doom: http://www.ohropax.de/

"The wise man lives while he must, not while he can".
Life doesn't necessary need to be long.

But what's the deal with the unreleased executables of tbl & madwizards demos anyway ?

And in english it gives you something this: "The wise man lives as long as he ought, not as long as he can."

& the clowns demo which doesn't seem to be available for some reason.

whatever, but please do NOT prohibit smoking on the grandstand. thanks.