Releasing at parties
category: general [glöplog]
demos are judged by history rather than placement. Winnerdemo, the kaki demo, obsoleet - a few years after they are released they will all be remembered for the wrong reasons.
- Do you remember winnerdemo ?
- Oh yeah isn't it the one with the obnoxious music and the c64 coloured penis ? thank god we moved on from all that crap
- eh..
- Do you remember winnerdemo ?
- Oh yeah isn't it the one with the obnoxious music and the c64 coloured penis ? thank god we moved on from all that crap
- eh..
Being a German, I prefer Kraut-pleasing demos.
If you're releasing a demo primarily to win ANYTHING: YOU ARE DOING IT WRONG.
Do it because it's FUN and it's something you want to make.
Do it because it's FUN and it's something you want to make.
selectanovel: go for Speckdrumm then, they have THE stuff ;)
Well, the point of why demos should be released at demoparties has been explained. The parties couldn't live without them, and there simply is nothing that beats the feeling of watching your production in front of the audience, getting direct feedback. trace, you really should know that, it's quite basic knowledge.
And if you think that the audience doesn't fit (too many gamers / non-qualified voters) just release at a DIFFERENT party then.
The matter of skewed votes mainly happens at smaller parties and in general if there only are a small number of votes - in these cases those groups score high that have a lot of voting members present at the party.
Evoke has been a good example for that. The problem with Evoke was that their voting system totally sucked. Instead of using Partymeister, they chose to role their own and failed. The system was so annoying (you had to re-enter the votekey each time you entered the system as it didn't manage to store a cookie) and mis-administrated (after compos were over it took hours until some organizer could be found to unlock the compo for voting) that probably most people simply didn't vote (I gave up on it, too). So in the end you mostly get votes by people who are willing to jump through all those hoops to vote up their own prods, instead of getting the general audience to judge about the quality.
But to sum this up: That's not a problem of the system, and no, we don't need new voting systems, at least not for "pure" (gamer-free) scene parties. We just need party organizers to not fuck up on the implementation and administration of already proven voting systems.
And if you think that the audience doesn't fit (too many gamers / non-qualified voters) just release at a DIFFERENT party then.
The matter of skewed votes mainly happens at smaller parties and in general if there only are a small number of votes - in these cases those groups score high that have a lot of voting members present at the party.
Evoke has been a good example for that. The problem with Evoke was that their voting system totally sucked. Instead of using Partymeister, they chose to role their own and failed. The system was so annoying (you had to re-enter the votekey each time you entered the system as it didn't manage to store a cookie) and mis-administrated (after compos were over it took hours until some organizer could be found to unlock the compo for voting) that probably most people simply didn't vote (I gave up on it, too). So in the end you mostly get votes by people who are willing to jump through all those hoops to vote up their own prods, instead of getting the general audience to judge about the quality.
But to sum this up: That's not a problem of the system, and no, we don't need new voting systems, at least not for "pure" (gamer-free) scene parties. We just need party organizers to not fuck up on the implementation and administration of already proven voting systems.
Interesting to hear your views on compo-administration, Scamp. Especially after the farce that was the vote-key distribution at BP'07. Wrote you guys an email on that very issue, which, coincidentally, was never answered.
If someone makes demos thinking he's going to win maybe he shouldn't make demos.
Quote:
Being a German, I prefer Kraut-pleasing demos.
best quote ever. :D
Archmage: I don't see any mail from you on the breakpoint hotline list. And also none in my personal accounts. All mails that got sent to the hotline mail address got replied to, as I see it.
Also, I wonder what "farce" you are talking about. One votekey has been handed out per visitor badge returned, as always. The only thing that rightfully caused confusion has been a drunk infoteam organizer who though it would be funny to fake-handout multiple votekeys to 2 other organizer, with one of the two being the one who had printed the keys in the first place. We had some serious discussions about this and made it crystal clear that such jokes in front of the visitors are completely unacceptable and a sign of disrespect to the voting visitors. The organizers involved have excused and promised to never do such jokes again. Other than that, no harm has been done - obviously, those votekeys didn't get used, but got destroyed in the organizing area.
But hey, sure, it must be conspiracy!!!1
Also, I wonder what "farce" you are talking about. One votekey has been handed out per visitor badge returned, as always. The only thing that rightfully caused confusion has been a drunk infoteam organizer who though it would be funny to fake-handout multiple votekeys to 2 other organizer, with one of the two being the one who had printed the keys in the first place. We had some serious discussions about this and made it crystal clear that such jokes in front of the visitors are completely unacceptable and a sign of disrespect to the voting visitors. The organizers involved have excused and promised to never do such jokes again. Other than that, no harm has been done - obviously, those votekeys didn't get used, but got destroyed in the organizing area.
But hey, sure, it must be conspiracy!!!1
Also by releasing at parties you might end up with that:
http://www.asd.gr/~navis/baby1.jpg
:-)
http://www.asd.gr/~navis/baby1.jpg
:-)
Ack! I better don't release at parties then, I don't want kids yet.. :P
Quote:
Also by releasing at parties you might end up with that:
http://www.asd.gr/~navis/baby1.jpg
... that sounded wrong. what were you actually releasing at what parties? :S
I heard from a visitor at evoke, that at one point it wasn't possible to vote for all demos of the compo but just for like 7 or 8.
no idea whether this is true and it was a bug from the voting system or something else.
anyway, neglecting the fact that I also thought that the evoke results are somewhat totaly screwed up - isn't that something we already know since ages? so who cares. it's about the fun of competing anyways.
no idea whether this is true and it was a bug from the voting system or something else.
anyway, neglecting the fact that I also thought that the evoke results are somewhat totaly screwed up - isn't that something we already know since ages? so who cares. it's about the fun of competing anyways.
awww cute as hell!
Scamp: I wrote the message on the BP party intranet, not wanting to make it a stupid pouet issue or a big deal. I still don't, but I can't really help myself when I see what you write here. If you still have the correspondance from the intranet, you'll find my message there under my handle. Still, if you don't, I'll quote myself from another thread here which describes the situation (written some time after BP when I started to realize that I wouldn't get a personal answer):
I don't expect you to comment on all stuff that goes on at BP, and I have no complaints on the comporesult as such, but I still find it a bit strange that this passed you by at the time.
And yes, such a small incident might be insignificant, but in my eyes it still qualifies as a farce - especially when you take the time off to brag about the infailability of your system.
Quote:
... there was one episode that took me by surprise and made me quite disappointed: some time after the compos I went to the infodesk for my votekey. The rather drunken guy behind the desk gave me two, while doing the "hush"-finger. I didn't know him, nor did I ask for two votekeys. Later on I also met a guy who bragged about being given five votekeys. For all I know this might be a common thing, but for me I think it reflects quite badly on the party.
I don't expect you to comment on all stuff that goes on at BP, and I have no complaints on the comporesult as such, but I still find it a bit strange that this passed you by at the time.
And yes, such a small incident might be insignificant, but in my eyes it still qualifies as a farce - especially when you take the time off to brag about the infailability of your system.
The message system on the BP party intranet, that is, adressed to the organizers.
archmage: I do remember your quote (no idea right now whether it was an email or whatever, but I read it somewhere) and even though scamp doesn't remember and/or find it: he's right, we discussed this quite a while with the team and came to the conclusion he already mentioned.
Party voting is rushed and most of the time there are just too many entries to remember them all (especially if you're drunk as fuck =D ), but I don't think that'll ever change...
Comforting might be how people rate here on pouet. Good, classic demos often make it into the top ten (though I'm missing "Live evil" there ;) ). And what can be more satisfying than people giving you a thumb up years after the release commenting that "This is a classic." "Still a great demo." etc. or give you a "coup de ceur"?
Comforting might be how people rate here on pouet. Good, classic demos often make it into the top ten (though I'm missing "Live evil" there ;) ). And what can be more satisfying than people giving you a thumb up years after the release commenting that "This is a classic." "Still a great demo." etc. or give you a "coup de ceur"?
Archmage: How about a big nice warm cup of shut the fuck up?
Seriously - you are calling the Breakpoint votekey distribution a farce and spreading conspiracy theories because you *didn't get a reply to a message you've sent to someone through the party intranet system a few hours before the party ended and that intranet shut down*? Wow.
What's next? Your next complaint will be a paper with ancient greek signs buried somewhere at the north pole, and then 8 months later you'll spread that we orgas are evil cheating bastards because we didn't listen to you? ;)
And as I just explained it to you in long words, this has NOT passed me. That organizer joke has been discussed internally right after the party in detail in the team. There hasn't been any harm done. Nobody got multiple votekeys. There has been no votecheating.
Sure, you still may call this a farce. Just as I may call you a stupid retarded lamer, who spreads bullshit to make himself more important, as you've got no point whatsoever. :)
Seriously - you are calling the Breakpoint votekey distribution a farce and spreading conspiracy theories because you *didn't get a reply to a message you've sent to someone through the party intranet system a few hours before the party ended and that intranet shut down*? Wow.
What's next? Your next complaint will be a paper with ancient greek signs buried somewhere at the north pole, and then 8 months later you'll spread that we orgas are evil cheating bastards because we didn't listen to you? ;)
And as I just explained it to you in long words, this has NOT passed me. That organizer joke has been discussed internally right after the party in detail in the team. There hasn't been any harm done. Nobody got multiple votekeys. There has been no votecheating.
Sure, you still may call this a farce. Just as I may call you a stupid retarded lamer, who spreads bullshit to make himself more important, as you've got no point whatsoever. :)
Calling Archmage a lamer would actually be the biggest farce of this thread actually, by far ;)
*sigh*
Quote:
If you're releasing a demo primarily to win ANYTHING: YOU ARE DOING IT WRONG.
Which reminds me, i want to win the assembly democompo next year. I heard rumours that navis is going to the army, and i was thinking to bribe fairlight to keep out.
;)
scamp: red card! :O
People tend to vote for demos that have one defining moment or one noteworthy Übereffekt (often featured in the screenshot on pouet, for good reason) that made a lasting impression.
For 8-bit Wonderland it was the tetrisscroller, FR25 - discoguy walking through Travolta-discoroom, Second Reality - flight through city, Liquid Wen - start of second part, Debris - "Godzilla-hund", this list could go on and on... so perhaps the new Cocoon demo just lacked that one defining moment?
For 8-bit Wonderland it was the tetrisscroller, FR25 - discoguy walking through Travolta-discoroom, Second Reality - flight through city, Liquid Wen - start of second part, Debris - "Godzilla-hund", this list could go on and on... so perhaps the new Cocoon demo just lacked that one defining moment?
If you're releasing a demo primarily to win ANYTHING: YOU ARE DOING IT WRONG :
Why doing a competition with a ranking then ?
Why doing a competition with a ranking then ?
