pouët.net

Gloom: Not sure why you'd find that odd - if you remove an alias that has prods assigned to it, what would you rather have happen then?

Menace: you don't remove the prods, you remove the alias from you. The prods should remain associated with an unclaimed handle.

Example: someone adds "Yo Mama" as an alias for you, and then they add "So Fat" as a prod credited to "Yo Mama". If you then want to disassociate yourself from that prod -- you can't. You'd then have to first remove the alias, then remove the credit which was automatically transferred to your actual handle.

gloom, gasman, menace: Perhaps these things should be distinct actions, so you can choose to "merge" with an alias (where the current behavior sounds sane) or "disassociate" with an alias (where gloom's expectations sounds sane)?

kusma: the problem is that if I want to remove an alias that's been attributed me, the only way to do it right now is by accepting that all prods associated with that alias will then be associated with my main handle instead.. which is neither sane nor practical (for me). I understand the behavior from a database point-of-view, but as a user, it's no good.

I don't always agree with Gloom when he's complaining about shit on the internet but when I do it's because he has a good point...

Gloom: I see what you're saying now. As for whether changing the way it works into the more complex way you're describing, I'd have to leave that question to Gasman.

Sure you can... edit the prod, change the dropdown under the 'by' field to 'Add a new scener named 'Yo Mama'', submit.

(but yeah, I'll try not to get too defensive about this stuff: if something isn't intuitive, then it's my job to fix it, even if it makes perfect sense from a database point of view. Having an 'edit' icon against each prod on a scener's page would probably be a good start here...)

Maybe what you could do is have names and prods associated and then "link" names together, so when they're unlinked the prods don't mingle.

gloom: I completely understood that point, which is exactly why I suggested two distinct operations.

Gargaj: Yup, that's kind of what we're doing - one scener/group has many nicks, and productions are attached to a specific nick. The bit that's currently missing is the ability to transfer one of those nicks to another (new or existing) scener, other than by tearing it down and rebuilding it in the new place. Shouldn't be difficult - just another feature to squeeze in while somehow not making the UI more confusing...

Perhaps you should make the nick->scener relationship optional so you can express "we have no clue who that guy is", and give people the possibility to (re)claim orphaned nicks.

The UI is really cool imho, great job.

Ask for beta access on IRC, it's worth it ;p.

Ffs. Even google does open betas these days

kb: I think this talk of 'unclaimed handles' might be a bit misleading - there's no ownership of scener profile pages. (Well, I have some ideas about adding a sorta-kinda-ownership system later on using SceneID, but that's for the future.)

For reasons of database sanity (e.g. having an ID to put in the URL) a nick needs to be associated with a scener/group record at all times, although often that will be a mostly-empty record that's been created on the fly as something to hang that name off. (One very important design goal for us is the ability to enter the results of Assembly music compos without having to stop every couple of rows and go to a separate 'add scener' form because the author isn't in the database yet.)

Perhaps that's just an implementation detail, but as I see it, there's no fundamental difference between a name that's been spotted once attached to some random prod, and a fully fleshed-out scener history with group memberships and web links, other than level of detail - the former isn't something that's "in limbo" and needs to be reclaimed - so it still makes sense to look at it as moving a nick from one scener record to another.

You disregard the context. This was specifically from the case where I had been credited through an alias for myself which I had not added either. You don't expect everyone to just "drop by" their profile pages to check for new aliases added to you, and also go to every single prod page where that alias was credited?

In this context, I meant it as "an alias/handle that was once associated with another handle, but is now without a link to any existing handle" -- as in: what would happen if I removed an alias association from my current handle.

excellent to see more betatesters! however, when you add new prods, please mind demozoo's Capitalization Policy in prodnames.

The music on this group is not the same group as the demos: dev.demozoo.org/groups/11495/

Rasmus: Fixed.

question : is there any article, layout or preview about demozoo that can already be viewed (i mean open to public) ?

Yea, how about at least some screenshots to get the mouth juices going? ;)

What rasmus/loonies said.

Tigrou & Salinga: Why care about screenshots when you can have the full experience? Stop by our channel and we'll work out beta access.

trc_wm: ...whatnow? I believe I fixed Rasmus'es request. Even though he already has access, and COULD have done that himself. :)

I'm guessing trc_wm is referring to
- yes, and half the time they end up with monumental fuck-ups like Google Buzz :-)

Those of you with good memories will remember the first iteration of Demozoo back in 2007-09. On that occasion I did set myself a hard deadline of Assembly '07 to launch it, in whatever state it was in, with the intention to develop the site further 'in the open'. This was a mistake. "Release early, release often" is good advice, but it only works if you've got the core feature set nailed on the first release. I didn't, and as a result it was widely dismissed - quite justifiably - as a second-rate Pouet clone. First impressions do count, however much you think you're above that sort of marketing crap.

The new Demozoo is in a damn sight better shape than Demozoo v0 ever was, but I'm not going to repeat that mistake. As much as I'm excited by the way things are coming together, there are still plenty of things to do before it can be considered 'ready': a proper informative homepage, a fully implemented site design, various usability improvements. (And no, we're not holding out for perfection: the checklist of 'essential features for launch' is a tiny fraction of our wishlist.) We'll go public when we have a site that we're happy with, that lives up to expectations and that the whole scene can get behind. Not before then.

I remember v1 and it wasn't as bad as you make it sound. :)

Anyway, is v2 supposed to be a superset of pouet (aka the pouet v2 that never happened)? Or will pouet coexist with this new platform. Like, having pouet for the discussion and commenting and demozoo2 for the archiving?

Also, I'm not big into IRC these days, are there screenshots of how it looks now?

tomaes: Demozoo is not Pouet, and that is not its function or intention. Pouet is Pouet, Demozoo is Demozoo. I am totally putting this in our faq, so I don't have to answer that any more times. :)

If you are not into irc, that is fine, but we are not about to go create a bunch of screenshots of an unfinished site for people who refuse to take the route offered to them. Seriously, dude. :) We are working on core functionality still, and the site will likely receive a visual overhaul before launch anyway. As Gasman mentions,



is something we have on our checklist of things that need to get in there before we are launching full.y

In the meantime, you are more than welcome to reacquaint yourself with irc if you can't wait - or just wait, and we'll have the full experience ready for you as soon as we can.