questions on 4k music generation

category: music [glöplog]
Hi folks,

I am working on my first demo (and a 4k it is!).
I came up with an effect I will be using it, but I have no idea on music generation. I am using iq's 4k framework to get the project started.

How much memory from the demo do you reserve for music?
Would you share some helpful tutorials on music generation?

added on the 2016-01-14 12:08:00 by varko varko
By "memory", you mean space?
added on the 2016-01-14 12:11:40 by Gargaj Gargaj
I think, in regards to compressed size... what's a good compressed exe size without music, so there is enough headroom.
added on the 2016-01-14 12:20:22 by EvilOne EvilOne
For a 4Kb demo, just try to fit the music in (around) 1Kb. I mean, of course, 1Kb in the crunched executable! Of course, this is not written in stone and it depends on particular circumstances.

Use tools like Crinkler's "compression report" to figure out this and other important things.

Happy coding! :]
added on the 2016-01-14 12:25:58 by ham ham
i've seen 4k's with 128bytes of sound and 4k's with over 2k of sound, so it depends a lot what you want to do. 1/4th of the space for audio seems a decent enough ratio.

if you're looking for tools to make music for 4k's, 4klang is a nice place to start:
added on the 2016-01-14 12:50:54 by psenough psenough
There was a talk, I think on last revision from wayfinder about 4klang, the most used tool to create music...

or you can just modulate sine waves... there was a thread here where they modulated sine in the browser... That got quite nice...
added on the 2016-01-14 12:51:54 by FeN FeN
found it:
added on the 2016-01-14 12:53:49 by FeN FeN
Before I give our 4ks to Juippi for music, they're usually 2.7k to 2.9k compressed. This disregards extra sync data that needs to be added afterwards, but I'd say the music usually ends up being 1.0 or 1.2 kilobytes.

Of course, we don't use krinkler or 4klang. We have a complete toolchain of our own from start to finish, so this is not necessarily applicable to the general situation.
added on the 2016-01-14 12:54:25 by Trilkk Trilkk
By "memory", you mean space?

Yes! Thanks for the correction.

That was fast! Thanks all! If I have any other further questions, I will write here.
added on the 2016-01-14 13:00:41 by varko varko
I end up using 1.6k-1.8k for music.
added on the 2016-01-14 13:42:28 by xTr1m xTr1m
Nowadays there's 8klang too. By the way, this is my first post. :)
added on the 2016-01-14 14:06:40 by Vousti Vousti
wayfinder's 4klang seminar (From Deadline 2015, not Revision)
8klang could have a good potential for 64k intros. ;)
added on the 2016-01-14 14:55:33 by Vousti Vousti
No, that's what 64klang2 is for :)
added on the 2016-01-14 15:42:23 by xTr1m xTr1m
Never heard! Gimme a link! :)
added on the 2016-01-14 15:56:31 by Vousti Vousti
Yep, Virgill... See you later.
added on the 2016-01-14 16:13:49 by Vousti Vousti
You may also want to try out Clinkster. It is easier to use for the musician than 4klang, though not as versatile.

The code size for the Clinkster player is around 700 bytes. My music data is usually 500-800 bytes on top of that, depending on complexity.
added on the 2016-01-14 16:18:54 by Blueberry Blueberry
The breakdown of Hydrokinetics is about 1465 bytes for music (including 4klang player), 1700 bytes for the visuals, and the rest for setup code, rendering and crinkler overhead.
added on the 2016-01-14 16:21:19 by noby noby
Blueberry, sounds like an offer to me. ;)
added on the 2016-01-14 18:03:42 by Vousti Vousti
Music usually takes 1/4 to 1/3rd of small sized Demos Space.
added on the 2016-04-05 18:35:40 by ollj ollj
One way of doing music for tiny intros is to target some byte limit and then squeeze it until it fits, and then squeeze some more. And more. Or at least that's how I've done it.

But it might be interesting to try a minimalistic approach. Start from zero, and add just one musical element. Try to make it sound good and interesting on its own, and so that it takes as little space as possible. Consider if it makes musical sense already. If not, tweak first instead of adding more elements. As soon as you think it makes musical sense at all, stop. Don't care if you didn't use all of the allocated bytes.
added on the 2016-04-05 20:10:16 by yzi yzi
Old thread, but... our last two 4k intros where about 2.8kb before music+synth, so we usually use around 1.2kb
added on the 2016-04-06 10:48:54 by shash shash