NVScene 2008!
category: general [glöplog]
In the end, the demokits were a gift from NVidia to 'the demoscene' and a few people got lucky. Like a raffle, I guess.
Also people got some nice releases - and will probably get MOAR (right cocoon, TPB, Outracks... etc. ;) )
and that was supposed to be (isn't that right, cocoon, TPB, Outracks... etc.? ;) )
By putting demokits at the hands of coders, nvidia will easily get more high-end content to stress test their hardware and drivers. So in a way I think they win no matter what. And the compos at nvision were awesome. Huge success, I'd say.
(Trixter: I do feel strongly enough about the whole concept of 'separation due to stupid boundary bullshit' to have to point this out for anyone who might feel that it's normal and accepted behavior. If it looks like I'm bashing you, I'm not. I only bash you when it comes to 'telling a party 7 years after it started that it should change it's name on some vague technicality' (: Or, in the use of "we've have" such as the line below. (: )
So, when I got into the scene, in North America, back before 1990, we didn't give a shit what continent people were from. Or country. It was neat, yeah, I mean, "Hey, this is from some guys in Yugoslavia... but they speak English! Oh there's some ... odd slavic stuff... hey cool look at that, 4 raster splits... how did they do that... I'll bet they used sprites..."
When Europeans were calling our bbs's and so on, well, on Skullbuggery we had a lot of "Germans" and some "Italians" because the box still worked there. Until, of course, Kimble. Then it sort of lessened... mind you, there were a lot of guys from England calling, but we didn't call them Brits or anything, because we were all in LSD, and in some cases, Nerve Axis, or Skid Row...
The fact that we also had Australian sceners we talked to... ok, yeah, we occasionally called them 'the aussies.' But it was never in terms of a rift, just that they were really, really far away. I sort of equated it to a third time zone... you had the Aussie/New Zealand folks, then you had the Europeans, then you had us in North America/South America (there were some guys from South America calling boards back in the day.) But since we had more than just one continent calling, or more importantly, we had friends on other continents... it didn't matter that they were on other continents. It mattered that we were friends.
And I never really referred to the Delabu Alama guys as "the mexicans" because they were the Delabu Alama guys, and they just happened to be from Mexico. The part where they made cool demos was far more important, the part where they were kicking our asses in the US by actually MAKING shit was more important. But that comparison did very little to motivate anyone (: Mostly cuz the sort of people who would get upset because Mexicans were doing better are the type of people who can't exactly figure out how to press the 'enter' key. Or the 'any' key. Or hell use an Amiga. Or call any sceners who actually tried to help them set up their lameass party in Salt Lake 'Eurotrash.' Even though some of us were in the US. Yes, that sort of person, who gets upset because someone is from another country, that sort of person is the sort of person who does NOT get the scene, period.
So, no, we haven't always called them Euros. Trixter has, apparently. And the US being such a large area, with sceners so far apart from each other, little things like 'dialects' creep in.
But I find it difficult to deal with a 'separation' of sceners like this. It's a form of complete bullshit:: "Oh, they think they're better than us because they actually make the demos and we just sit on our asses and consume them. Well, we're better because we didn't waste any time. Ha Ha Ha. Why are you trying to make a demo, anyway, just let them do it... hey you're doing it wrong, just let them do it! Hey! stop that, that talking to people in New Zealand! They're not from the US! You'll get cooties!"
Now, Trixter and I see things differently and I don't think that he actually is one to separate this way, but I do know some folks who WOULD, and it alarms me that they'd possibly start with this whole preconcieved notion that there's some form of rift between countries, continents, and other crap like that. Well, there is, it's called "Legalize is a shithead." Trixter is so not Legalize.
I guess what I'm writing a lot of crap here boils down to this:
Quote:
Not offended, but I got into the scene in 1990 and we've (north americans) have always called european sceners Euros. My use of the slang term predated the currency :) and besides we all know what I mean.
So, when I got into the scene, in North America, back before 1990, we didn't give a shit what continent people were from. Or country. It was neat, yeah, I mean, "Hey, this is from some guys in Yugoslavia... but they speak English! Oh there's some ... odd slavic stuff... hey cool look at that, 4 raster splits... how did they do that... I'll bet they used sprites..."
When Europeans were calling our bbs's and so on, well, on Skullbuggery we had a lot of "Germans" and some "Italians" because the box still worked there. Until, of course, Kimble. Then it sort of lessened... mind you, there were a lot of guys from England calling, but we didn't call them Brits or anything, because we were all in LSD, and in some cases, Nerve Axis, or Skid Row...
The fact that we also had Australian sceners we talked to... ok, yeah, we occasionally called them 'the aussies.' But it was never in terms of a rift, just that they were really, really far away. I sort of equated it to a third time zone... you had the Aussie/New Zealand folks, then you had the Europeans, then you had us in North America/South America (there were some guys from South America calling boards back in the day.) But since we had more than just one continent calling, or more importantly, we had friends on other continents... it didn't matter that they were on other continents. It mattered that we were friends.
And I never really referred to the Delabu Alama guys as "the mexicans" because they were the Delabu Alama guys, and they just happened to be from Mexico. The part where they made cool demos was far more important, the part where they were kicking our asses in the US by actually MAKING shit was more important. But that comparison did very little to motivate anyone (: Mostly cuz the sort of people who would get upset because Mexicans were doing better are the type of people who can't exactly figure out how to press the 'enter' key. Or the 'any' key. Or hell use an Amiga. Or call any sceners who actually tried to help them set up their lameass party in Salt Lake 'Eurotrash.' Even though some of us were in the US. Yes, that sort of person, who gets upset because someone is from another country, that sort of person is the sort of person who does NOT get the scene, period.
So, no, we haven't always called them Euros. Trixter has, apparently. And the US being such a large area, with sceners so far apart from each other, little things like 'dialects' creep in.
But I find it difficult to deal with a 'separation' of sceners like this. It's a form of complete bullshit:: "Oh, they think they're better than us because they actually make the demos and we just sit on our asses and consume them. Well, we're better because we didn't waste any time. Ha Ha Ha. Why are you trying to make a demo, anyway, just let them do it... hey you're doing it wrong, just let them do it! Hey! stop that, that talking to people in New Zealand! They're not from the US! You'll get cooties!"
Now, Trixter and I see things differently and I don't think that he actually is one to separate this way, but I do know some folks who WOULD, and it alarms me that they'd possibly start with this whole preconcieved notion that there's some form of rift between countries, continents, and other crap like that. Well, there is, it's called "Legalize is a shithead." Trixter is so not Legalize.
I guess what I'm writing a lot of crap here boils down to this:
Quote:
yadayada. you might've forgotten that we're all friends, anyway.
That's wonderful, Truck. Now go make a demo out of it.
I KNEW that would come :D
@trixter: are you the same trixter that i met up with at naid and other stuff back in the day? (xerxes here)
can i get videos of the seminars somewhere ?
kb: you're right, that IS the way to handle it... despite the whole 'meme' crap to it, it is the way to do it.
xerxes: yes it is (: Did he call you a Euro at that time, what with you being in Chicago and all? (:
xerxes: yes it is (: Did he call you a Euro at that time, what with you being in Chicago and all? (:
Fuckings to Euros.
truck, okok i admit, i started it but, is there really anything wrong with the word "Euros"? We've been calling trixter and co panamericans for quite a while now.
I think we'd only start getting offended if trixter started calling the "euros" kalmykians. not that there's anything wrong with kalmykians, but most european sceners arent kalmykians.
I think we'd only start getting offended if trixter started calling the "euros" kalmykians. not that there's anything wrong with kalmykians, but most european sceners arent kalmykians.
doom, that's what i heard pia say the other day!
Gay means happy!
I just wanted to thank everyone who organized and participated. Thanks to all my heroes who shook my hand, spoke to me, and make me feel like it wasn't a burden to do so -- your kindness is appreciated. Thank you, and I hope to reunite with some of my new friends soon!
thejuice: you were in the rv with us when it was being.. relocated.. right? a fine intro to the scene as any :). i'll add ya to demoscene.us.
Yes, I have video of the relocation effort. :)
...euros...erotic...
eurotic you mean?
a little discussion i had with dixan yesterday that might be interesting to mention in this thread:
i wonder how big is the % of scene followers who can actually watch the demos released at nvscene working realtime on their machine..
i hear all this blablabla on how we support the pc scene over other platforms because its what everybody uses so our prods get more exposure, but then as it turns out the most asskicking prods are all for very recent hardware and sdk updates only. but yeh i guess in 2 years time alot more people will be able to watch it realtime due to it being on pc then if it was made for, oh, lets say xbox. but still, nowdays, most of the viewers will have to watch it from video because:
a) dont have quadcore machine
b) dont have ps4.0 gfxcard
c) dont have vista
d) dont have latest dx10 dist
and in a year when 80% of the scene followers are in the machine standards that enable us to watch these things realtime, more new stuff will be out by then so we wont be caring about running these old things that often anyways.
so my question is, why the hell are we all mostly aiming for realtime only instead of abusing the possibilities that come with rendering first and doing the universal running realtime version next year?!.. i mean yeh sure "my engine does this realtime on my machine woohoo awesome" feeling is great, but you could just as well be saying "my engine will do this realtime on a machine someday, right now i can easily make it look extra fucking awesome", which we as a scene seem to be somewhat scared to embrace upon considering the lower number of animation entries and artists active in the scene these past years.
just a couple cents to open up some discussion about it.
im also curious who will play the heresy linchmob on this issue. o_O
i wonder how big is the % of scene followers who can actually watch the demos released at nvscene working realtime on their machine..
i hear all this blablabla on how we support the pc scene over other platforms because its what everybody uses so our prods get more exposure, but then as it turns out the most asskicking prods are all for very recent hardware and sdk updates only. but yeh i guess in 2 years time alot more people will be able to watch it realtime due to it being on pc then if it was made for, oh, lets say xbox. but still, nowdays, most of the viewers will have to watch it from video because:
a) dont have quadcore machine
b) dont have ps4.0 gfxcard
c) dont have vista
d) dont have latest dx10 dist
and in a year when 80% of the scene followers are in the machine standards that enable us to watch these things realtime, more new stuff will be out by then so we wont be caring about running these old things that often anyways.
so my question is, why the hell are we all mostly aiming for realtime only instead of abusing the possibilities that come with rendering first and doing the universal running realtime version next year?!.. i mean yeh sure "my engine does this realtime on my machine woohoo awesome" feeling is great, but you could just as well be saying "my engine will do this realtime on a machine someday, right now i can easily make it look extra fucking awesome", which we as a scene seem to be somewhat scared to embrace upon considering the lower number of animation entries and artists active in the scene these past years.
just a couple cents to open up some discussion about it.
im also curious who will play the heresy linchmob on this issue. o_O
ps: i've said it many times, the scene is a different ballgame nowadays. either you play by the new rules, or you confine yourself to a restricted audience by sticking to the old game. both are rather legitimate options, imho.. :)
i wouldnt ostracize anyone from wanting to keep doing what they feel like its best, i just wonder why so many of us seem to follow the realtime or death ideals when the original logic is quite illogical for quite some years now..
i originally considered that gfxcard market would stabilize to a standard which people would try to follow for the sake of audience market, but it seems every year it just keeps getting worse. or well, not worse, but equally bad, ridge dividing new cards and old cards, nvidia cards and ati cards, now even opengl 3.0 stuff..
i originally considered that gfxcard market would stabilize to a standard which people would try to follow for the sake of audience market, but it seems every year it just keeps getting worse. or well, not worse, but equally bad, ridge dividing new cards and old cards, nvidia cards and ati cards, now even opengl 3.0 stuff..
we didn't buy 386 computers to code 286 demos. that's all I have to say about this.. demos are about pushing the limits, and there's the video for the rest of us.
you're talking about days where it took 2 years to deprecate your machine from the majority of the new kick ass prods, nowdays it takes less then 6 months -_-